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So what’s the difference? Scalley vs. Ndiaye?

Welcome Cyclones Fans! › Forums › Utah Utes Sports › Football › So what’s the difference? Scalley vs. Ndiaye?

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    • 06/12/2020 at 2:55 PM #124511
      5 1
      UTE98
      Participant

      The title of this article to me seems rather interesting.

      “Troubled UNC player recants slur charge”

      https://www.southcoasttoday.com/article/19980331/news/303319941

      So does Scalley deserve more or less punishment? I’m not sure Ndiaye ever received any sort of punishment. It was his last game as a senior. And he had a history, as you can read in the article of letting his temper get the best of him. 

      So should Scalley be excoriated for using the N word in what he intended to be a message to a fellow coach who was black? 

       

    • 06/12/2020 at 3:09 PM #124514
      5 7
      User Suspended
      Member

      You really don’t see the difference? 

      1. Scalley is/was a coach, not a player.

      2. Scalley admits he used the N word.  It’s not a he said/he said argument.

       

      Does Ndiaye, coach at a University? If he does then ya, he should be held accountable for lying. But to try to draw these two things as the same is very “fox newsy”

       

      • 06/12/2020 at 3:25 PM #124517
        3
        UteThunder
        Participant

        They are clearly different, but I think the question can be asked: Which is worse? Scalley used the N word in what seems to have been intended in a somewhat playful/positive way. Ndiaye made a false accusation of Johnsen using the N word in order to slander an innocent person. Neither is good, one is clearly worse. Both should have known better, but one is expected to have known even better than the other due to his age and position.

        • 06/12/2020 at 4:30 PM #124521
          1 1
          dystopiamembrane
          Blocked

          Scalley used the N word?!?? Why the hell would he do that?

    • 06/12/2020 at 3:38 PM #124518
      5 1
      EagleMountainUte
      Participant

      It is funny how man attempts to compare situations in order to get some sort of moral absolute. 
      One thing I know to be an absolute. Don’t be an asshole. Was Scalley being an asshole?  No not at all. In fact the family and Shah both didn’t see it that way from what I have seen. 
      Ndiaye was being an asshole. 
      Case closed. 

      • 06/12/2020 at 4:51 PM #124522
        5 8
        SkinyUte
        Participant

        If a white coach calls a black player the n-word (even if he says it to another coach), he’s being an asshole.

        And I would bet my house that if you asked Scalley, he’d tell you the same.

        • 06/12/2020 at 4:58 PM #124523
          5 2
          EagleMountainUte
          Participant

          Nah I would say Scalley is a dumbass. Dumbass for probably using a school phone to inadvertently send a message to a potential recruit. He was a dumbass for not reporting it to the Head coach(something far more concerning). He was also a dumbass for not reporting to the AD. Easier to face the music now rather than seven years later in the middle of a race war. 

          My hypothetical would be which is is more harmful in 2020?  White guy uses the N word directly as a racial slur or Black guy claims he was beat up by Trump supporters in Chicago not only because he was black but because of intersectionality he is homosexual but turns out it is all made up?  Are there degrees of harm?  How many people care about white asshole vs black asshole in 2020?   

          • 06/12/2020 at 5:22 PM #124524
            4 6
            SkinyUte
            Participant

            Um…they’re both assholes?

             

            Very impressive strawman though.

            • 06/12/2020 at 5:35 PM #124525
              4 1
              EagleMountainUte
              Participant

              Most of the radical white nationalist in this country are not taken seriously at all. A Hollywood actor claims absolute farce of a story and there are still people who believe him. Because it is a power struggle. When your “strawman” supports your power base it is fine and dandy to let it go on. 

              • 06/12/2020 at 6:41 PM #124526
                5 4
                SkinyUte
                Participant

                You lost me.

                Smollet lied, got busted for it, got charged, got arrested, and recently got charged again, all of which were exactly the consequences that should have happened.  Who on earth still believes him?  Hell, I haven’t heard about or thought about that guy in over a year.  Now that I am, my only thought is “wow, that guy was an asshole and got what he deserved”.

                And how does his situation connect to simply hand-waving away the increasing white supremacist activity in the US, as you just did (“Most of the radical white nationalist in this country are not taken seriously at all”)?

                 

                • 06/12/2020 at 8:35 PM #124527
                  3 3
                  EagleMountainUte
                  Participant

                  Nevermind.  Obviously I am operating under different presumptions than you. I don’t believe Scalley was being an asshole based on the circumstances as I understand them. I will leave it at that. 

                   

                • 06/12/2020 at 8:50 PM #124528
                  6 4
                  UteThunder
                  Participant

                  Increasing white supremacist acivity? According to who . . . CNN? 

                  Get real.

                  • 06/12/2020 at 9:07 PM #124534
                    3 2
                    SkinyUte
                    Participant

                    According to pretty much every group that looks at such things.

                    But since none of them are Fox News, I’m sure you’ll simply dismiss them all.

                    EDIT: I tried to include a bunch of links, but the board has eaten my reply twice, so I’ll just let you google “increase in white supremacy in the US” for yourself.

                    • 06/12/2020 at 10:36 PM #124535
                      5 3
                      UteThunder
                      Participant

                      Riiight . . . The FBI reported a DROP in hate crimes, aka hate group ACTIVITY, last year.

                      The Southern Poverty Law Center does claim an increase in the number of existing hate groups overall, including white supremacists. However, considering they labeled Ben Carson as an extremist and have labeled some Christian groups as hate groups simply because they oppose same-sex marriage, I have a hard time taking them seriously.

                      Edit to add: From an NPR article – “In hate crimes fueled by racism, African Americans continue to be the most frequently targeted, though anti-black incidents overall fell to a record low share of all hate crime in 2018.”

                      • 06/13/2020 at 12:07 PM #124540
                        1 2
                        SkinyUte
                        Participant

                        Key words there being “share of”.  While the overall number of hate crimes went down slightly, violence was way up overall.

                        While the number of reported hate crimes dipped slightly in 2018, violence against individuals rose to a 16-year high, according to numbers released Tuesday by the FBI.

                        And while anti-black incidents as a percentage of the whole were down, violence against other groups increased significantly.

                        Here’s the article, which links directly to the FBI report.  https://www.npr.org/2019/11/12/778542614/fbi-reports-dip-in-hate-crimes-but-rise-in-violence

                      • 06/13/2020 at 5:50 PM #124544
                        1 1
                        UteThunder
                        Participant

                        No, the key words there were “record low” as in hate crimes against blacks were at the lowest they have ever been. Doesn’t exactly fit the “increased white supremacist activity” narrative, though.

                      • 06/13/2020 at 6:46 PM #124547
                        SkinyUte
                        Participant

                        Two things:

                        1.  Nowhere in that report (that I could find, anyways) did it say that the number of crimes against blacks were at the lowest they’ve ever been.  It said, specifically, that “anti-black incidents overall fell to a record low share of all hate crime”.  Meaning that only 47% of all hate crimes were against black people, as opposed to higher percentages in years past.

                        Basically, the crimes are being spread across more minority groups, instead of primarily targeting the black population.

                        2.  You do know that white supremacists don’t only target black people, right?

                        All those other groups – such as Latinos who experienced a 13% increase last year and a 48% increase over the last 5 years?  Or Sikhs – whose attacked tripled?  All those count as activity as well. 

                      • 06/13/2020 at 8:53 PM #124549
                        UteThunder
                        Participant

                        I am well aware of both things. What that report fails to provide is details as to who is hating who. It tells us who is doing the hating (percentages by race), and who is being hated (percentages by race, religion, orientation, etc.), but not who the haters are specifically hating. Were the anti-black crimes committed by white people or hispanic people? You realize it isn’t just white people who can be hateful towards black people or oppose illegal immigration or are bigoted towards homosexuals, right? Black, hispanic, asian, you name it, there are people from every race in this country who could or would commit a hate crime against black people or hispanics they believe are here illegally or against gay people in their community. 

                        It’s interesting that you seemingly assume all hate crimes are committed only by white people. Or at least all hate crimes against black people. Maybe that’s not the case, but you sure present that way.

                        This thread, though, is about black-white relations regarding use of the N word. The implication when you brought up a rise in white supremacy activity was obviously along those same lines. The FBI report clearly shows there hasn’t been a rise in hate activity against black people and actually suggests white supremacist activity, at least in that regard, is on the decline relative to other hate crimes. But again, we don’t know what percentage of these hate crimes were white people targeting black people. 

                    • 06/13/2020 at 7:23 AM #124538
                      5
                      Minnesota Ute
                      Participant

                      Even if I bought the premise, I might still be left thinking that increase just MAYBE is related to an increasing number of people getting sucked into the “race war” as a result of the climate that judges me by the color of my skin (and my willingness to self flagellate) and not by the content of my character.

                      In other words, I’m not sure you cure racism with white guilt. But of course this is all orchestrated to keep everyone from focusing on the real problem which is war on drugs, militarization of police, welfare state, and failure of public schools. 

                    • 06/13/2020 at 1:13 PM #124541
                      4 2
                      Central Coast Ute
                      Participant

                      I Googled it and the only “sources” can just as easily be dismissed as you did with Fox News. See how that works?

    • 06/13/2020 at 1:00 AM #124537
      6 8
      LetItRide
      Participant

      Sorry bro but Fox News is In the same arena as the other news networks. All run by the leftist white liberal elitists. Minorities are their ponds in the chess game.

      White power groups?????? Lol. They are a mere blip on the radar. More other hate groups out that there that dominate the landscape. U have been fooled.

      Man this country has become soft and brainwashed. Glad I don’t associate with either group. Love being a free thinker……. go Utes.

    • 06/13/2020 at 6:36 PM #124546
      4
      Utesbyfive
      Participant

      No longer a football topic.

    • 06/13/2020 at 7:40 PM #124548
      7
      Charlie
      Participant

      There are no news programs on TV currently. There are a variety of opinion programs and some political groups prioritize exporting opinion more than others. Opinion vs news gets easier to recognize when the title of the report emphasizes an opinion, the talking head repeats the opinion several times, a banner running at the bottom repeats the opinion, and the summary drives home the opinion. Pretty much both sides do this. It’s like listening to one side of a murder trial. When was the last time you heard a news story without being told what your opinion should be? You need to be older than most U fans to remember. Remember when KSL would give an editorial comment once a week noting it as such and for the most part left opinion out of the news? Not long ago, you could travel internationally and see news about back home. It was different, went fast, just the facts or an observation, almost clinical in nature. Those days are gone, no source leaves it up to you to decide what to think about their story. And that is the state of the mainstream media, it gets worse moving on to social media. Will we get smarter or less informed? Most everything has improved greatly in my lifetime, the ‘news’ has not.

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