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Jim Winder's ideas for the homeless has some merit IMO here's why

Welcome Cyclones Fans! › Forums › Politics › Jim Winder's ideas for the homeless has some merit IMO here's why

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    • 03/31/2017 at 8:42 AM #32127
      PorterRockwell
      Participant

      Homeless shelters should be for those they truly are accepting of help and want to better their own situation. Ie get educated get a JB etc 

      there is a certain percentage of people that do in fact want to be homeless. So rather than cycle them through the courts on infractions and misdemeanor charges   Since these people want to camp out etc why not give them an area where they can camp as long as they want as long as they don’t break the law 

      some may characterize Jim’s approach S out of sight out of mind.  I would disagree.  Jim is wanting to give each subset in the population what they want   This would appear to be a win win for most everyone 

    • 03/31/2017 at 9:20 AM #32130
      1
      AZswayze
      Participant

      Roughly half of the homeless population are either severely mentally ill, or addicted to narcotics, which is an illness in its own right. Are shelters really the best solution for these folks? I recognize the need for shelters, but I’m wondering how much we compound the problem by lumping all homeless together (metaphorically speaking), and acting as if the problem is solved.

      • 03/31/2017 at 9:55 AM #32137
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        pedro
        Participant

        Source?  to my knowledge there have been no good studies to suggest that this is true.  In Utah alone you have three large factions of homeless.   Those that have truly hit hard times and lost their homes or been kicked out of their homes by loved ones.  Those that are addicted to drugs, alcohol etc…  And those who literally would rather be off the grid for a myriad of reasons.  

        The reason I contest your statement of 1/2 is that there is really  no way to know.  The first groups is more likely to utilize resources that are available.  The third group are likely to never use any of the resources and often go unaccounted for.  The 2nd groups is all over the map as to what resourced they will or won’t use.  

        Several years ago a group of U students tried to get an accurate count of the homeless.  What they experienced was that it was nearly impossible to truly know.  

        I would argue that many have mental illness.  I would argue most do not.  I would argue that those with addiction will resist any resources provided to help them to reat their addiction, but would happily take advantage of other resources.  

        My point is this, we are literally spending millions to build new shelters when in reality (to your point) we need to be spending it on the homeless as INIDIVIDUALS.  If we were to do so, a new shelter would not be needed.  

        Personally, Winder’s approach is a step in the right direction if you ask me.

         

         

        • 03/31/2017 at 10:13 AM #32141
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          AZswayze
          Participant

          http://www.nami.org/Learn-More/Mental-Health-By-the-Numbers

          This is specifically citing people living in shelters. This study (HUD) is not the end-all-be-all, and can almost be called a survey, but I’ve seen many studies where the number is close to the 46% stated here. Also, I didn’t say that most have mental illness. Close, but your claim makes some inferences I’m not comfortable with.

          As for your argument, I’m not sure where we differ. I stated that treating all homeless people as a homogeneous group is a poor approach. I wasn’t necessarily disagreeing with OP.

      • 03/31/2017 at 9:56 AM #32138
        1
        Utah
        Participant

        This is the problem. Another area where healthcare is just broken. 

        It’s not left vs right. It’s too vs bottom. 

        • 03/31/2017 at 11:01 AM #32154
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          ironman1315
          Participant

          Those damn toos keep trying to take the tos and twos stuff from them! ;P

          • 03/31/2017 at 11:03 AM #32155
            1
            Utah
            Participant

            Amen, brother. Down with the damned toos! 

      • 03/31/2017 at 10:46 AM #32151
        PorterRockwell
        Participant

        That’s Winder’s point. We continue to use a one size fits all approach to a complex issue.

        Wh do we continue to try and force people that don’t want housing into housing?

        If someone really wants to homeless why do we fight them on this issue and insist that they live in housing? If they really want live in tents why not provide a safe place to do so that’s safe for them and others?

        • 03/31/2017 at 10:48 AM #32152
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          AZswayze
          Participant

          I know, I’m sorry, my wording/tone is clear as mud. Jumping back and forth between this thread and the earlier one doesn’t help.

          • 03/31/2017 at 11:43 AM #32161
            PorterRockwell
            Participant

            No need to apologize Jim is being criticized for wanting to search homeless people prior to entering the shelter He seems to be taking some heat for it from some folks.

            I think Jim is correct. Have the shelters for those that want to get off drugs, participate in Voc rehab or getting education or skills to get employed

            Those that want to be homeless give them a barren field some porta potties and let them camp we should stop trying to force them into complying with societal norms of living in housing etc. as long as they don’t hurt others leave them be

    • 03/31/2017 at 11:49 AM #32162
      2
      Tony (admin)
      Keymaster

      I work by the shelter near Rio Grande. There was just a stabbing outside our office about an hour ago. It’s pretty brutal around here.

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