Everybody's up in arms about Trumps immigration ban, but his executive order

[AZswayze]

on deregulation is far more troubling and indicative of the type of President we have elected. The fact that we’re so concerned about appeasing free market capitalists that we’re throwing out arbitrary numbers that make no logical sense is disturbing. Some regulations are good, and cutting two just because you must add one is an asinine and childish way to create legislation. I’m all for cutting bureaucratic red tape, but good grief is this silly.

[ironman1315]

I really like the idea of cutting red tape, but this is a hammer approach when what we really need is a scalpel. Sigh, but this two for one deal is certainly easier to push through than saying we are going to go regulatory body by regulatory body and review the rules and regulations to simplify them, cut the unnecessary ones, and make it easier for people to know how to comply with the law.

Also, random thought, a lot of the financial regs hit the big banks lightly since the money is pretty fixed. I wonder if there shouldn’t be a “Widow’s Mite” rule that hits them so hard that it is no longer a line item in the budge for violating it.

[AZswayze]

It’s worse. It’s a hammer that he pulled out of his ass. Can anybody explain the rationale behind a two for one budget cut, other than to cut regulation for the sake of cutting regulation.

[ironman1315]

I certainly can’t. It’s so damn stupid. And I like the idea of a crap covered hammer as it relates to this EO.

[sacute]

I didn’t see any evidence or proof for your speculation and assertion.  I had a number of facts to back up my point.  You accuse Trump of “pulling facts out of his ass” but at least he had some facts.  

[AZswayze]

What “facts” are you referring to?

[sacute]

Why should we be up in arms over being overegulated?  The cost of of all regulations to the economy was $1.9 trillion in 2015 alone according to the Competitive Enterprise Institute.  The federal government was about to declare federal jurisdiction over every “standing pool of water” in America until Trump stepped in.  The cost of Obamacare regulations will be $1.8 trillion according to the government’s Office of Information and Regulatory Affairs, OMB.  The cost of Dodd-Frank’s regulations of Wall Street is $34 billion annually estimated by Standard and Poor’s.

This is just the economic cost of regulation.  The social cost to America has been disruptive, as well.  For example, the advisory letter on transgender bathrooms, “prosecutorial discretion” in the exercise of Mexican Immigrant regulation and the Department of Justice’s intervention in civil disturbances with respect to the conduct of police in local jurisdictions.

Now I agree that some regulations are necessary when the perpetrators regularly, consistently and with impunity harm our citizens.  However, we may have seen a zeal to overregulate in the last 8 years.              

 

[AZswayze]

You entirely missed the point. Deregulation in itself isn’t the problem, and this is actually one area where I tend to lean right. Some is necessary, but as I said, I’m all for cutting unnecessary spending and red tape across the board. The issue is that Trump pulled a number out of his ass and applied it to a complex issue. This two for one nonsense is the thinking of a child.

We keep arguing over policy issues with Trump, but the real fox in the henhouse is this acceptance of “alternative facts” and knee jerk reactions.

[Anonymous]

Yeah? I’m going to say the zeal for over regulation, as you put it came about because some people will anything and everything to get a buck including but not limited to lying, cheating, stealing etc.

[sacute]

I didn’t see any evidence or proof for your speculation and assertion.  I had a number of facts to back up my point.

[AZswayze]

Is your motherboard on the fritz?

[Anonymous]

didn’t offer any but since you ask how about the last recession, did unscrupulous lenders take advantage of people through loopholes in the laws/regulations?  did it trigger any of the onerous regulations you are struggling with?   Or are you one of those people that think/believe gov’t employees sit around thinking about regulations to make peoples lives more difficult?

Is it really a stretch to think that regulation comes about because dishonest people game the system?

Medicare started a competitive bid process for certain DME categories because some vendors were charging 500% on items like wheelchairs because they knew they would get paid.  Kind of like $20,000 toilet seats.

[Puget Ute]

That isn’t just ‘lost’ money used to push papers around, however. It is not a zero-sum game and if those regulations are cut that won’t necessarily mean that money will automatically flow into the economy (or the Treasury, or your pocket, etc).

The regulation costs in the ACA were the costs of covering all customers, including those with pre-existing conditions.

The Dodd-Frank regulation cost includes the costs of doing business in a way that will not tank the economy again.

In the town where I used to live in New England there was a nice piece of property in an idyllic little valley, that was maybe 350-500 acres or so. I always wondered why it wasn’t developed, because I would have loved to put a house on 10 acres or so and it would have been a great place to live. Unfortunately an owner back in the 30s-40s used to dump used motor oil and fuel directly on the ground. Sometime in the late 50s the down downhill discovered high levels of aromatic hydrocarbons in their drinking water, and this created a huge problem. (Keep in mind that most people had their own wells as there was no municipal water system and no centralized water treatment system). The problem was eventually traced back to the oil dump at the farm, and the oil had contaminated the well and the connected aquifer. The farmer who actually dumped the oil was long dead by that time, so there was no way to remedy the situation by going after the original offender. The town eventually had to just condemn the land for occupancy, and do their best to contain the contaminated soils to protect the aquifer.

This type of situation is precisely the reason there needs to be regulations. In the case of water we need to remember that we all live downstream. Likewise in every other case, the economy is completely interconnected and problems in one area inevitably leak over to create consequences in other areas. This is the reason it is simply irresponsible to blindly cut regulations without taking a very close look at the downstream consequences of cutting those regulations.

[Puget Ute]

I don’t know why this didn’t line up under sacute’s post, but the threading seems to be off today for some reason.

p.s. AZ, just wait until you see the upcoming ‘Protecting Religious Freedom’ EO that is coming down the pike. We are well on our way to becoming RFRA-stan, just like Pence did to Indiana.

[Puget Ute]

I’m not sure what new regulation we will come from eliminating this one, but the effects will be big. The Senate today passed a bill to kill a regulation that forced coal mining companies to avoid allowing runoff from mountaintop removal coal mines from running down into the streams and rivers downstream.

Coal mines can release lead, copper, arsenic, mercury, sulfites, other toxic heavy metals, etc into the water supply. I can’t believe that anybody in 2017 can think this is a good idea.

from the article:

They argued the regulation would be such a financial hindrance for the coal industry that it would kill jobs in economically distressed areas of Appalachia already struggling due to the sector’s market-driven downturn.

The mining companies don’t give a s**t about the health of anybody downstream, they only care about maintaining their industry. And they hide behind the jobs they create in the economically-depressed area as though they are the savior of the people who get to live around the pollutants.

Also don’t forget that repealing the ACA is going to DIRECTLY affect the people living in these areas, because the ACA is paying for their treatment for Black Lung Disease.

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