Interesting, in light of refugee/immigration controversy

[zeous]

People clamoring for an empathetic approach might find it in their best interest to take a hard look at what Europe is dealing with now, who has had millions of “refugee” immigrants over the last couple years.  That’s a whole lot of people, and it sure looks like an invasion and neo-colonization to this observer, when neighboring countries of the same religion are taking in none of the so-called refugees.  Please take a hard look.  Our backyard is ultimately our own responsibility as a self-governed people, particularly we men’s responsibility.

Condemnation (or embrace) without investigation is the height of ignorance.  Please take some time to really look at other available footage of no-go zones, camps, and street violence in Europe on Youtube if you haven’t yet.  It may surprise you.

[Utah]

Every study I’ve seen, when immigrants have moved into a struggling neighborhood, the neighborhood thrives. 

This is nothing more than fear driven. We need to be smart. We need to be careful who we bring in. We need to make sure we don’t overwhelm areas that are accepting refugees/immigrants. 

But, we need to help. It’s the Christian thing to do. It makes no sense to not help. Not helping goes against everything we supposedly stand for. What’s the point of all the wars started by the right, if we won’t do this now? 

[utbc]

You are conflating all immigrants with muslim immigrants. Different scenarios. Go to Europe. Non muslim immigrants become fully integrated but it’s the complete opposite with muslim immigrants. Google second and third generation opinion polls of muslim immigrants views on homosexuality, women’s issues, religious tolerance, etc. it’s God awful. Check out some of bill maher’s shows on the subject or go to malmo sweeden and walk through any number of neighborhoods while eating bacon. You literally will not make it out alive. There’s a reason Sweden is now the rape capital of the west. 

[Utah]

What study do you have, what source, newspaper article, etc, do you have, that shows this is a problem in the United States? Again, immigrants are currently rebuilding the rust belt and might be the key to saving the economy. 

Can you see why I’d be a little skeptical? 

I have proof. I might be wrong. If you can show me how I’m wrong, I’ll listen. Until then, I’ll stick with what we’ve seen in this country. 

 

“One thing I always notice while I’m driving through here,” says Michigan State Rep. Harvey Santana, as we roll through Dearborn bustling retail district, “is that there are never any vacant storefronts. If you see a ‘for sale’ or ‘for rent’ sign it is gone in a few days. The middle-eastern community invests in their neighborhoods, and you can see the difference that makes when you look at other parts of the city.”

 

“The story that isn’t being told is that the middle-eastern immigrants that come to Michigan are largely well-educated and people with a drive for success,” says Ahmad Chebbani, who owns a large accounting firm and is chairman and co-founder of the American Arab Chamber of Commerce. “They are taking a risk just to relocate here. They are coming here for opportunity.“

 

But in politics, the definition of human decency tends to move over time. It used to be that Republicans were in favor of immigration as a source of cheap labor and it was Democrats who fought for tighter immigration limits to increase native workers’ bargaining power. This was especially true in states like Michigan, where liberal unions and conservative business leaders had a push-pull relationship on immigration quotas. But with the decline of union power—and the growing anti-immigrant mentality of the far right—the debate has flipped. Democrats now support more immigration for social justice reasons while Republicans generally oppose it, in part because the far right voter base sees them as little more than purveyors of crime and sucking off the entitlement teat.

Let’s be smart about this issue and not scared.

[Utah]

Another Article. I thought the right was for business owners, economic growth, and the American Dream? Weird. 

Don’t be scared. People used to scared of Mormons the way you are scared of Muslims.

[zeous]

A compilation where European colonists speak for themselves and display their behavior:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sirj6qNLAEU

[Utah]

Where are your studies of refugees that have come to the UNITED STATES?

[Utah]

Let’s use some intelligence here. 

First, I’ve lived in Sydney for a couple of years. They have second and third generation Muslims all over the place. Those guys/gals wear jeans, work hard, party hard, drive their loud Utes, and contribute to society. Yeah, some wear religous garments, but guess what? SO DO I! 

Now, onto Sweden. Did you know that Sweden changed their definition of rape, to be a lot more broad? That is why their rape numbers are up. 

[quagmire]

I don’t care what Swedens definition of rape is, any sex crime is not acceptable. What an absurd thing to try and defend. The simple fact is, whether it’s a coincidence or not, as the number of muslims rise in Sweden, so has their sex crimes.  And let’s be frank, would you feel safe leaving your daughter alone in any Muslim dominated area? I sure as hell wouldn’t. 

[Utah]

You are not this stupid are you? Do you believe that ice cream causes crime? 

[Anonymous]

nah, ice cream just causes people to get fat when they over indulge, like eating a quart a day or something like that I suppose

[quagmire]

Oh name calling now huh? You are no different then all of the liberals who block city streets and cause riots because other people have differing opinions. Fact – the more muslims in an area, the s**ttier the place is. And you are stupid if you don’t see that.

[Riot West]

Fact – the more muslims in an area, the s**ttier the place is. And you are stupid if you don’t see that.

Fact?

I think you mean “impoverished.”

[utbc]

Wrong on both accounts. Here is a survey of British muslim opinions. https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/7861/british-muslims-survey

its undoubtedly an underestimation of true feelings. If you dig in there you see things such as 1/3 British muslims support stoning people, the victims of which are usually women who were raped and thus committed adultery.  Sorry, but I don’t want people with those backwards belief systems here. Society doesn’t explain these things to other groups who immigrate here, whom I’m personally in complete favor of coming here

[Anonymous]

It would appear that you are opposed to refugee/immigrants coming here? 

So are you Native American or do you have family that were immigrants to the US?  I’m guessing most of us here have relatives that went through Ellis Island.  

America has been built by immigrants   Utah is right.   This whole thing is about people fearing those that are different whether it’s skin color religious beliefs or whatever.  

I’m not saying we shouldn’t secure our borders but we need to be smart about it.  A wall between the US and Mexico isn’t going to do it  people will tunnel under or figure out a way over or around.  

[Utah]

Get over your fears. Actually look into this. Don’t buy the propaganda. Do something for YOUR own self interest. These are PEOPLE, just like you and me. They want to work. They would LOVE to move into Detroit and create a vibrant community that pays taxes, buys houses and iphones. 

My God, use your brain. We used to be the Muslims. We were driven from the country due to the silly fears and misunderstandings. 

Don’t be that dumb. Be better. Be smarter. Let’s actually do something intelligent to make this country better. 

[zeous]

I think the video evidence speaks for itself.  Now please use your eyes and your brain and get over your moral supremacism long enough to take a hard look at the practical aspects of similar numbers moving in here, if they act and believe like those in the video of Europe. 

[Utah]

What % of refugess that we accept are combat aged males? 

 

[Utah]

What strikes me as so freaking funny, if you take out “Muslim” or “Refugee” or any other buzzword and insert “Mormon”, then you have an article written in the 1800’s. 

Or if you insert “communist” you have an article written in the 1950’s. 

Or “Black” or “Negro” you have an article written in the 1950’s (many by our prophets). 

Or “Hippie”…boom 1960’s and 70’s.

Do you see a pattern? Wake up McFly.

Be smarter than this. 

And even though we’ve survived the Mormons and the Blacks and the Hippies and are actually better off having embraced the good from each of those groups…I think 20 years from now, when Rust Belt cities make their grand comeback on the backs of immigrants and refugees, we will be a much better country because of it.

Don’t be scared of change. Embrace it and become better. Mormons should understand this more than anyone. Our god is constantly changing, and every time he changes, our church grows and gets stronger.

[zeous]

Wake yourself up you condescending moral supremacist prick.  I’m not Mormon, though I grew up one.  Don’t make assumptions about other people, because you know what happens when you assume. 

You are the one triggered here, ranting over and over with emotional appeals.  Do you see that?  Calm yourself down and try using reason for a change.  Take a hard look at the second video compilation I posted in response to one of your other emotional outbursts above, and consider the reality of having to deal with similar situations in your neighborhood. 

I get the desire to reform Islam, and that there’s a movement inside Islam to rid itself of medeival beliefs like death to apostates, death to adulterers, and death to non-muslims.  But they are not there yet.  They speak and act for themselves, and that evidence is far more significant than anything any authority figure tells you. 

The question is why must they come here?  Preceeding that question is why, if DC is creating so many refugees, does DC continue to do so?  I think the morally proper thing to do first is to stop bombing them, and provide assitance to help them rebuild what Washington DC has destroyed.  Why is that war necessary?

Here are a few more questions for you to ponder, if you can calm yourself enough to reason:

Why are no refugees being taken in by Saudi Arabia or other Arab countries?

Why are no refugees being taken in by Israel?

Why are no refugees being taken in by stable African Muslim countries or by Pakistan or Indonesia or any other Islamic country?

Why are they seemingly only going to Europe, the US, and Canada, and being sold with guilt trips to trigger the empathy of the people?

Why are even leftist intellectuals in Europe and the U.S. calling for caution on this issue?

Why do you think that all people believe the same as you and value the same things as you?  That’s called solipsism and is a huge mistake.

[quagmire]

Consider Muslim handling of rape, Muslim views and treatment of gays, Muslim treatment of women as second class citizens, etc..

Sorry but you can’t simply replace Muslim with Europeans, Asians, blacks, or even Mormons and have it be true. We embrace change, but not going backwards in time. 

[Utah]

LOL. You sound like 1880’s Missourians. 

Consider Mormons and their blood atonement, slashing their throats in temple ceremonies, marrying 14 year old girls, Joseph Smith marrying other men’s wives, seeing visions, not following the Bible, treating women as second class citizens, etc….

Use your god given brain here. 

You want to change those extremist views? Get their women and children here, give them iPads and X-Box’s and let them see a better way of life. 

[Utahute72]

I agree with the sentiment that we need to be smart not scared.

But you have to look at some of the issues Europe has had. Immigrant from some cultures do indeed reinvest in their communities lifting them up, but on the downside you have the city in Belgium that has been completely taken over by Muslim immigrants which has produced an unending supply of terrorists, including the Paris bombers.

Yes most of the immigrants are seeking a better life, but included are some bad actors. Germany reported over a thousand rapes over the Christmas to New Year’s time frame, all committed by Muslim men, mostly immigrants. The FBI, ICE and Homeland all have indicated it is very difficult to vet the immigrant stream because of lack of intel in that region.

I don’t think either the Obama policy of speeding up the process or the Trump policy of total ban is the right path. It seems like there should be a middle ground, where we can sift through the hoard of people fleeing that region to allow those that truly want to come here to do so. It seems also like if we could provide a viable alternative, like a secure area in the middle east, many would prefer to go there as opposed to moving to Europe or America. I just don’e think either side is working hard enough to find good solutions to the problem.

[Utah]

How many men are accepting into the US? 

Half of the Syrian refugees brought to the U.S. so far have been children; and [2.5%] are adults over 60. And I think you will have heard that only 2 percent are single males of combat age. So we – there’s slightly more – it’s roughly 50/50 men and women, slightly more men I would say, but not – not a lot more men. So this is normal that as you’re – as we set a priority of bringing the most vulnerable people, we’re going to have female-headed households with a lot of children, and we’re going to have extended families that are maybe missing the person who used to be the top breadwinner but have several generations – grandparents, a widowed mother, and children.

Be smart, which the US has been, in taking 98% women and children. 

Don’t buy the right wing bulls**t the blowhards are selling you. Do some research. Find some facts. Don’t let fear rule your decision making. 

Use facts, not rhetoric to make a decision

[zeous]

Does this claim of 98% women and children pass your eyeball test?  Have you even bothered to wander out into various areas of Utah to look for yourself? I challenge you to do so.  Go see with your own eyes and gather your own data.  Eat from the tree of knowledge and gain the first hand experience that bears witness of the truth. 

I think you are the true servant of fear here.  Fearful to face the possibility that your authority figures may lie to you and manipulate you.  Fearful to face the possibility that the knowledge you could gain by merely driving around parts of SLC may contradict the 98% women and children claim.  Yes, don’t let fear rule your decision making.  Practice what you preach, hypocrite.

[Author]

Posts