Moments like last night

[rbmw263]

Are going to make it that much sweeter when we win the Pac 12 next season. I want the team to hold on to that game all summer long and take it out on the conference next year. Especially the huskies.

[ladyinred]

Yes! Circle USC and WSU on the calendar too. 

[noneyadb]

Chip Kelly at UCLA is going to make the South ridiculously tough. Good Luck Utes!

[EagleMountainUte]

I heard he is going to Florida.  

[noneyadb]

He already has ties and name recognition to West coast recruiting. Not to say it wouldn’t carry over to Florida, but UCLA with Kelly is a slam dunk.

[EagleMountainUte]

Seems like that is why UCLA fired Mora a week early. I would have fired him in Salt Lake they were pathetic. 

[northernute]

I’ve heard a version of this every year since we joined the pac

[EagleMountainUte]

Seriously this time just wait. 

[rbmw263]

Sure. But for me it’s always been a hope that somehow our quarterback who isn’t good enough to win the conference plays well enough. We’ve seen the making of what can be a very good offense next season after another off-season to hammer out execution. Did you see what Huntley did to a VERY good defense with no o line to speak of yesterday?

This is a very young team that gave the cream of the conference all they could handle. I truly think that next year will be our best equipped team to actually get it done. We even saw massive improvement from troy Taylor as the season went on. Everybody needs another off-season and I think we could see something special 

[EagleMountainUte]

I know it will seem like I am being a dick. But serious question.  

With the way Huntley has been used and Taylor likes a Running QB do you expect him to be healthy all season?? Because we all point to his injury against Zona and the drop off Utah had. 

[ragtownute]

Why should we expect anything other than 5-4 or 6-3 at best in conference? Kyle said this team was deep and the most talented he’s had in the Pac and we’ve seen the same results. Sub-500 average in conference. Next year Oregon and Washington and USC all the other guys will be just as tough as usual. 

[gUrthBrooks]

The math has the answer. Lose 15-16 upper class man to the NFL, add new talent to the current talent buy the experience needs to be gained.

[ragtownute]

Hammer, I’m using math. We didn’t win with the NFL guys either. Tell me what changes. Math shows Kyle is 27-35 in PAC play.

[Utah]

We didn’t have a QB last year. 

We have a QB now. 

[ragtownute]

And a line that can’t pick up basic assignments. And a defense losing anchor defensive linemen. And we have no NFL quarterback. Huntley isn’t going to push us to 7-2 in conference by himself. 

Kyle’s numbers are supporting a LONG-TERM trend. We’ll have good years, and we’ll have bad years, and he’ll be lucky to finish above 500 in power conference for his career. His record in conference is average. Why are people having a hard time accepting the reality of this? The numbers are the numbers. 

[GameForAnyFuss]

His record in conference is average. Why are people having a hard time accepting the reality of this?

Conversely, why are some people having a hard time accepting the reality that it takes most programs a long time – a decade or more – to be consistently good in a P5 conference. Are there exceptions? Sure. But most of the time it takes a while to adapt. Everyone we play has a 20-30 year head start at being P5-quality. Even our expansion sisters from Colorad9 were P5 before they joined up.

My point is simply that, when Whit’s career is over, we should regard him as being slightly better than whatever his final record ends up being. The transition into P5 could not have been easy and he deserves credit for doing a pretty good (notice I didn’t say great) job of it.

[ragtownute]

Most programs take a decade or more to be consistently good? Or do you mean consistently average? The Kyle trajectory is on the average curve. Or below average, since at this point he is has a losing record all-time in power conference play, with no shows in a conference title game. Here are some examples of exceptions to your assertion that it takes a decade or more to build a consistently good program:

Bob Stoops at Oklahoma – Bowling for the first time in five years for OU in his first year. National title in year 2. 121-29 all time conference record. 9 conference titles.

Urban Meyer – BCS buster in year 2 at Utah. National title in year 2 at Florida. National title in year 3 at OSU. 82-15 in power conference games.

Gary Patterson at TCU (same conditions as Whit with Utah) – Conference title in year 3 in power conference. 99-40 in power conference games.

Chip Kelly at Oregon – 3 straight conference titles. 4 straight BCS bowl appearances. 33-3 in power conference games.

Nick Saban at LSU – Conference title in year 2. National title in year 4. And obviously Alabama results. 123-40-1 in power conference games.

Chris Petersen at Washington – Conference title in year 3. 22-13 in power conference games. Not counting making Boise what it is.

Mike Gundy at Okie State – Division title in year 6. Conference title in year 7. 2 BCS/NY6 bowl appearances. 68-42 in power conference games.

Dabo Swinney at Clemson – Division title in year 2. Conference title in year 4 and 8. National title in year 9. 61-16 in power conference games.

Kyle most looks like Dan Mullen at Miss State, or slightly worse. Never won the conference, bowl games in 7 of 9 years. Power conference record of 33-38 with one 10-win, 2 9-win, and a handful of losing/mediocre seasons. This is exactly who we are, and everyone that thinks we are going to magically start winning 7-8 conference games a year is out of touch with reality.

[GameForAnyFuss]

You’ve missed my point completely.

Oklahoma was already a P5 team when Bob Stoops took over.
Florida was already a P5 team when Urban Meyer took over.
Ohio St. was already a P5 team when Urban Meyer took over.
Oregon was already a P5 team when Chip Kelly took over.
LSU was already a P5 team when Nick Saban took over.
Washington was already a P5 team when Chris Petersen took over.
Ok. St. was already a P5 team when Mike Gundy took over.
Clemson was already a P5 team when Dabo Swinney took over.
Mississippi St. was already a P5 team when Dan Mullen took over.

Utah was NOT a P5 team when Kyle Whittingham took over. He had to drag Utah up a level. Those other coaches had to rebuild, but they were already P5 teams with P5 recruits, P5 money, P5 facilities. Utah wasn’t. Whit had to build all that, and it takes time. We’re still building.

Now do you get it?

[ragtownute]

Your point is that Utah is not a power conference team, and once we are, Kyle is going to turn this into a consistently good program. Takes about a decade or more per you. I do get your point but you don’t get mine. I said people need to accept the standard that Kyle has set for this football team, and that is no better than .500 level average in conference. There is nothing in Kyle’s results as a PAC member that suggest he is going to change that.

Show the evidence where “it take most programs a long time – a decade or more – to be consistently good in a P5 conference.” You have none because you’re making s**t up to fit the “Kyle is infallible” narrative that many subscribe to. It would be great to know the exceptions to your BS “decade or more” observation.

My point in calling out each of those successful coaches is that it doesn’t take a decade to win. It actually takes very little time if you’re talented as a coach. Trying to make the argument that Utah isn’t P5 yet is laughable. We are P5 for a full senior class.

Each one of those coaches made those programs into winners immediately, and it didn’t have s**t to do with nicer facilities, money, and “P5” recruits. Urban put us on the map and that 2004 team would have beat anyone in the nation. He turned BG into a bowl team…then won a couple national championships at different programs. All the other coaches on the list – same thing: immediate results that lasted through tenure. Patterson is doing it at RIGHT NOW at TCU (who you conveniently excluded from your list and is a perfect analog to Utah).

Are you implying that Kyle is going to do what those coaches did after we become a “P5” team, or that he is going to be consistently good after we become a “P5” team in a decade or so? So should we set the watches for 2022? Because if he’s not a gifted coach that will make an immediate impact once he has all the resources, then you’re saying he’s going to be average to above-average. Let’s call it good…in fact good enough for 4, 5, or 6 wins in conference every year. That’s respectable and we really shouldn’t expect more. That’s my point from the beginning; Kyle Whittingham is NOT going take this team to the promised land with 7-8 conference wins a year. He could barely do it in the MWC. That’s the reality and we should consider changing our expectations to align with what’s most probable to continue.

[noneyadb]

Didn’t Whitt already take this team to the “promised land” in 08? Guess that year doesn’t fit your narrative though

[noneyadb]

The only team comparable to Utah would be if Petersen had taken Boise to a P5 conference and continued his success there. All of those schools have a long history of football tradition, better recruiting grounds, and not located in a weird state.

Whitt has his flaws, particularly the final minutes of games he tends to flounder the most. The team also shows this lack of preparedness by being slow and lethargic when the game is on the line. Almost like a two minute drill is rarely practiced. 

Reality is Utah and Whitt can succeed in the PAC12, but the fine details of coaching, recruiting depth, team speed, and offensive line play all have to improve.

 

[EagleMountainUte]

I think Utah has succeeded in the PAC12. They just haven’t achieved it in winning the south and have fallen flat for the reasons you stated. The one constant has been Whitt who has failed to fix those issues again and again. Losing Chow was the bad luck part of it all but Utah ended up with Erickson who has recruited several athletes making Utah competitive. 

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