So, If you judged Whitt only on the last two years…
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- This topic has 25 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated 1 month ago by 2008 National Champ.
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ProudUteParticipant
I know it is not fair to do that. But, for a minute – assume that last year was his first season. What would you say/think?
We have lost 7 in a row and that is very bad. But, you know what is worse? Other than the CU game we were in or ahead in the other 6 games. We are finding ways to lose. Just look at Houston, BYU, ASU, TCU, and ISU. We led in the 4th quarter in all but the TCU game – we lost that game by 6. Losing the way we have lost is terrible. It will happen to every team occasionally, But, the 5 losses were all winnable and we lost all 5. That should NEVER happen. If Whitt cannot win any close games – he should … I will leave it up to you to fill in the blank.
Whitt is not the same guy/coach that he once was. I love Whitt and wish the circumstances were different. But, it is what it is and we need radical changes. Is he the guy to do it???
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EagleMountainUteParticipant
I think you have to judge Whitt primarily based on his current deal. He is going to make like 18-20 million over the next three years? Based on the past two years that isn’t very good value.
I guess you could argue he deserves it. I never understood “deserves”. It is an entirely subjective thing people want to justify using objective reasons but no one deserves anything.
I think many of his problems are going to go away because Rising is leaving. This has been the crutch he has relied on for the past two seasons. 2023 I still don’t understand how or why that was ever relied on but it got Whitt to 2024 with essentially the same problem only magnified.
Now the problems seem to have piled on to those calves I don’t see it getting better. Maybe it is combination of all the problems with Scalley trying to fix it as well. Which becomes a preview into the future.
I really don’t know. You can definitely see the issue in it all. I think the Poo Poo game was the failed turning point for this program which lead to this convenient blame it on Big12 and lack of money. Ignoring that the money they desired was spent on a rebuild of Rising.
Big12 sucks no doubt but don’t act like Utah isn’t a part of that suck. The current talent in that roster was always good for at least 8-9 wins. So you think Utah underperformed by 50% could Scalley done better? We will never know.
If I was being paid 5-6 million with no repercussions I wouldn’t care either.
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NorthernUteParticipant
I just got done typing this long paragraph saying I would give him a 3rd year to get settled in… but then I really thought about it. What is he settling into? He ain’t getting HIS guys, because he had them this season in abundance and was able to do more with less last season. So to be honest, I’m saying see ya later and we are moving forward with someone else. Maybe due to the contract I’d give him another year depending how I felt we were doing financially, but if I knew we’d be fine to cut our losses then I’d get rid of him. He had HIS guys, it was HIS year, and when it all came down to it, he not underperformed, he was terrible. The issue the entire year was the coaching, no other way to put it. Guys make mistakes and player have off games, but 7 straight isn’t players having off games. Most talented team we’ve had, arguably ever?(just my own opinion obviously) and coach blew it. Plain and simple.
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UtahParticipant
If he was hired after the Penn St Rose Bowl, I’d want him fired.
He’s gotten worse the last two years.
His recruiting has gotten worse the last two years.
His QB has regressed both years.If he was a two year old Utah HC I’d want him gone asap so he didn’t completely undo the good Whitt had built before him.
These last two seasons are 100% a complete failure.
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noneyadbParticipant
Sometimes a team has to fail in order too succeed, but the obvious mishandling of players, mismanagement of the game would have me asking some serious questions.
Personally, Whitt would get another season, but with an extremely short leash. By game 3 if there isn’t a noticeable difference there’d be a change.
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2008 National ChampParticipant
7 game losing streak. Rough equivalents in other sports would be 100 straight losses in MLB, or 50 straight in the NBA. The only people who don’t find losing 7 straight a fireable offense are rooting for the man and not the program.
The real question for everyone for anyone wanting Whitt to stay right now is: “How bad does it really have to get before you’ll stop pretending that past is more important than now?” Because if 2023 8-4 is considered a great coaching job due to injuries, 2024 4-8 is a complete and utter failure with the same circumstances.
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AlohaUteParticipant
I’d say give him one more year to turn it around, I think all coaches should be given a minimum 3 years.
But this isn’t Coach’s 2nd year, it’s his 20th and this is his first failure of a season. He deserves another 4 or 5 at minimum if he wants it to turn it around. He’s earned at least that much.
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ProudUteParticipant
Let me ask this question, Aloha, If you were king for a day and could choose who would be the coach on January 1st, would you choose Whiit or Scalley? Throw out everything else like Whitt’s contract, his status as a Ute football icon, etc. Who would be the best person to rebuild this program?
If Whitt does not go on his own, he will be the coach. The university cannot afford to buy out his contract. I just wich Whitt would make the decision so this program can rebuild. YES- REBUILD. We are in a dire position right now. We need to rebuild.
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UtahParticipant
Ugh. Honestly? Probably neither.
On the one hand, you have a guy who has been here a long time, but peaked in 2021 and has been getting worse ever since. Hell, even 2021 started off as a complete s**t show as he started Brewer or Bentley over Rising and it wasn’t until we lost to BYU and SDSU that Whitt pulled his head out of his ass and started Rising.
We should have been a playoff team in 2021.
In 2022, it was pure luck we made it to the PAC-12 title game.
2023 was a s**t show.
2024 is a s**t show.
Even Whitt’s two best years, he made HUGE blunders that cost him playoff spots.
Then we have Scalley. Whitt’s right hand man. No experience as HC. No experience outside of the program or Whitt.
I dunno.
A team like Utah…If you asked 100 people what Utah should do, removing names from the options, most would choose option 3:
Open the spot up to a nationwide search. Utah would be a top3/top 5 program. We’d have our pick of coaches. Hell, I’d even bet Chris Petersen would listen to an offer from us.
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jshame17Participant
What???
Utah is NOT a top 3/5 coaching job and Peterson? No chance.
Love Utah, but we need to accept what we are. A fun program that has some runs, but is sitting at the kids table and not rising to the occasion.
Zero built in recruiting advantages, limited NIL, bottom of a middling conference. We’re not a coaching destination spot.
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USS UtahParticipant
The Pac-12 routinely failed to get teams into the CFP.
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UtahParticipant
Utah is not a top 3/5 program.
What I was trying to say is that out of all the jobs available, Utah is a top 3, top 5 job. We would have a ton of coaches to choose from.
Hell, Kalen DeBoer may be available. I’d take him over Scalley. Hell, I’d take him over Whitt. DeBoer can make the playoffs.
There will be a lot of good coaches available in a few weeks. A lot of coaches a lot more proven than Scalley.
Scalley is a huge risk. I think he can do it, but to say he isn’t a massive risk is just ignorance.
Honestly, I bet Chris Petersen would listen to us if we called. I don’t know if he’d take the job, but he’d listen. That is how good of a job Utah is.
And to turn it over to a guy that has so little experience in coaching like Scalley has…that’s risky. I know, I know, you are hoping that Scalley can maintain what Whitt has built, but it is very risky.
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AlohaUteParticipant
I’d choose Whit. He’s been a successful head coach for 20 years, one of the best in the game.
I think Scalley will do great, but I don’t know it. Being head coach is a lot different and a lot of “grear hires” turned out to fail.
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jshame17Participant
This has to be trolling at this point.
Every business that has the same leadership for 20+ years, demonstrating the exact same approach, especially those that refuse any outside influence and keeps all “books” closed from “investors”, falls behind the competition and eventually fails.
Evolve or die…
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AlohaUteParticipant
Shouldn’t Whit be given that chance to evolve or die. He’s embraced NIL, he’s embraced the transfer portal, and he’s made it very clear that he’s looking at everything right now and how the program needs to evolve.
You don’t fire a great CEO because they have one bad year. You don’t fire a 20 year successful head coach who is one of the best in the game because of one bad season.
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jshame17Participant
1?
Okay.
I’m thinking about the repeat QB and offensive issues. We see the exact same approach every year. It happened with Wynn and building a team around the long shot that he could put on weight and return early from a badly damaged shoulder.
We saw it again with all smoke and mirrors around Cam and his shredded knee that would miraculously be good to go with the fastest recovery Imaginable …
I was with you until Whitt said he let Cam call the shots and stay in a game when he was clearly harming the team. Whitt chose a player over the team. period. That is inexcusable and worthy of cutting ties.
As a player, I would transfer knowing my coach was more willing to lose a game than hurt his favorite player’s feelings and bench him.
Was that booster and NIL driven? Or because he plays favorites and has lost sight of the job he’s there to do?
as much as he says he’s addressing issues, while we see nothing change week to week, I guarantee Lud would still be the OC if he didn’t fall on the sword and walk. Even Whitt said he had not talked to him and wasn’t expecting it.
3 conference titles in 20 years makes you a good coach, which he clearly is and worthy of all the recognition he has received, but he’s not GREAT..
For comparison, LaVell Edward’s had 19 in 29 seasons.
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2008 National ChampParticipant
Absolutely has to be trolling. No one in their right mind says He deserves another 4 or 5 at minimum if he wants it to turn it around.
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UM4GParticipant
I would ask what do we gain by him staying for another 4-5 years? Based on comments made on multiple threads, the general argument for keeping him seems to be “next coach will be bad, team will take a negative trajectory” paraphrasing but that’s the gist of it.
Using that logic, would it not be better to rip the band aid off now vs push the issue down the road 4-5 years?
I’ll reiterate the point I’ve made on other threads – a negative is not the only outcome of moving on to a new coach, case in point Whitt taking over after Urban Meyer. I’ll also admit that if Whitt stays another 4-5 years, a negative is not the only outcome, but right now all signs seem to be pointing that way.
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AlohaUteParticipant
1. He’s earned it
2. He’s a top 10 or 20 HC in the game
Why are you all so quick to assume that this season is the new normal? It’s far more likely under Whit that this is the anomaly.
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UM4GParticipant
We’ll just have to agree to disagree. I do not believe previous success should let this season be overlooked. 2012 & 2013 I could forgive because he needed a fair shot to get PAC level recruits & money, we saw what happened when he got that. This year and last he doesn’t have those crutches.
As I said I’ll admit he possibly could turn it around, but I just don’t see it.
This offense is not an anomaly, his offense isn’t going to suddenly change after nearly 20 years. The Huntley & Rising led offenses were the anomaly.
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ProudUteParticipant
Aloha, I truly respect your loyalty to Coach Whitt. My biggest issue with Whitt is that we had 6 games where we led or were within striking distance late into the 4th quarter. We lost ALL of these games. This is not acceptable in my book. This shows me that Whitt has lost this team and his ability to win games.
Does he deserve to stay, based on his past record? I think there may be an argument for that. But, for me – the time has come for a change.
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TrailgoatParticipant
Could argue looking at KW’s 14 year record in the P12/B12 era, 21-22 seasons are somewhat of an anomaly. KW’s overall P12/B12 conference record is 63-54 (minus Covid). Utah’s 21-22 conference record is 15-3. Outside of the 21-22 seasons, Utah averages 4.6 conference, median 4 conference losses per season. Utah is 5-5 in bowl games with no bowl win since 2017. Have no problem KW getting a big contract for his 21-22 seasons. 6-11 over the past two seasons with all that’s going on with the program is not acceptable for a coach earning a $6+ million base yearly salary. 7 straight losses is more than just another “bad” season when the coach communicates 2024 may be the most talented team he’s coached. Making this season worse is the B12 overall is a garbage football conference. KW is on year two of his 6 year contract. There’s good financial reason to ride out a couple more years to acquire the bulk of his payout. Dumb move by Harlan signing KW to a 6 year contract being at the end of his career knowing KW was never leaving Utah. Next couple weeks we’ll find out the direction of the program.
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Ute DubParticipant
We don’t have a full running back. Sorry. We don’t. We have a 6-10 play running back. We can’t close games.
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Jim VanderhoofParticipant
The old school coaches Whitt Gundy Ferentz have been trending in the wrong direction. They’re two generations removed from the incoming players. Young players want younger coaches that can relate. Lansing Smart Riley have the pulse of the new generation of athletes. They have big NIL backing them and have more innovative visions.
BYU gets a young innovative BB coach and suddenly they have deep pockets. A coach in waiting should be no more than 1 year. Whitt could be a valuable resource for Scalley. Scalley should be sending the new message to the players.
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USS UtahParticipant
I’d like to give Whitt the opportunity to demonstrate that this year was an aberration. If he cannot get bowl eligible next year, then this year was not an aberration.
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2008 National ChampParticipant
I’m okay with giving Whitt a prove it year but only on the condition that he overhauls his entire offensive staff. I wouldn’t commit to 3 years under any circumstances based on his proximity to retirement and downward trend of results
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